Agent_Smith (Hive Bee)
02-12-02 09:06
No 268457
      Metal Alkoxide synth  Bookmark   

Could someone please post or propose an OTC source or OTC synth for a metal alkoxide, preferably something like tetramethyl or tetraethyl orthosilicate.

Thanks.

blah blah blah something clever blah blah blah, email at dateline@nbc.com
 
 
 
 
    foxy2
(Distinctive Doe)
02-12-02 09:14
No 268463
      Re: Metal Alkoxide synth  Bookmark   

Agent, Its been a while since you've been around.

Silicon Alkoxides?
Never heard of those

Don't you mean Sodium Alkoxides?
We do have this new beautiful procedure courtesy of Antoncho
Post 257912 (Antoncho: "Alkali metal alkoxides: finally, OTC!", Novel Discourse)

Foxy

Stay Informed (http://www.mapinc.org/)
 
 
 
 
    Agent_Smith
(Hive Bee)
02-12-02 18:46
No 268637
      Re: Metal Alkoxide synth  Bookmark   

I'm not sure if sodium will work.  I suugested silicon because I'm interested in the react of the alkoxide with water to form a jelly like SiO2 and liquid HOCH3.  Unless I'm mistaken, this reaction would proceed differently with Na... does NaO2 even exist?

blah blah blah something clever blah blah blah, email at dateline@nbc.com
 
 
 
 
    Rhodium
(Chief Bee)
02-12-02 18:50
No 268639
      Re: Metal Alkoxide synth  Bookmark   

NaO2 does exist, it is sodium oxide. Could you please elaborate on why you are interested in that SiO2 + MeOH reaction?
 
 
 
 
    Agent_Smith
(Hive Bee)
02-12-02 19:32
No 268655
      Re: Metal Alkoxide synth  Bookmark   

So do we know if the NaOCH3 produced in Antonchos reaction reacts in water the same way Si(OCH3)4 does?

Si(OCH3)4 creates a SiO2 gel, can NaOCH3 be expected to do the same?


blah blah blah something clever blah blah blah, email at dateline@nbc.com
 
 
 
 
    Rhodium
(Chief Bee)
02-12-02 23:04
No 268742
      Re: Metal Alkoxide synth  Bookmark   

No, it won't. You need silicon alkoxides for that. What do you want the gel for?
 
 
 
 
    Agent_Smith
(Hive Bee)
02-13-02 06:06
No 268924
      Re: Metal Alkoxide synth  Bookmark   

It would occur to me that Fe, or Sn or maybe Ti would behave like Si and form the gel, no?  How would I modify the procedure Anotoncho showed in order to use one of these?

(Rhodium, I'm sorry to evade your questions, because youre infinitely helpful, but I'd rather not say what I need it for right now, and just point at patent 6,160,190 instead)

blah blah blah something clever blah blah blah, email at dateline@nbc.com
 
 
 
 
    Agent_Smith
(Hive Bee)
02-13-02 20:53
No 269238
      Re: Metal Alkoxide synth  Bookmark   

I did some more checking...  what I really need now is how do I reduce SiO2 to Si, or ultimately SiCl4?

Or mayeb someone knows of a good OTC source of Silicon metal... perhaps some electrical component that contains a good quantitiy for me to pilfer?

blah blah blah something clever blah blah blah, email at dateline@nbc.com
 
 
 
 
    Agent_Smith
(Hive Bee)
02-18-02 20:38
No 271363
      Re: Metal Alkoxide synth  Bookmark   

No one knows?

blah blah blah something clever blah blah blah, email at dateline@nbc.com
 
 
 
 
    Karl
(Hive Bee)
02-18-02 20:43
No 271369
      Re: Metal Alkoxide synth  Bookmark   

Large chunks of Silicon are commonly found as paper weights in semiconductor physicist's offices.
 
 
 
 
    Osmium
(Stoni's sexual toy)
02-18-02 22:41
No 271409
      Re: Metal Alkoxide synth  Bookmark   

SiO2 + 2Mg ---> 2MgO + Si

I'm not fat just horizontally disproportionate.
 
 
 
 
    Neron
(Hive Bee)
10-17-02 20:20
No 369637
      SiCl4  Bookmark   

2C + SiO2 -> 2CO + Si
Si + 2Cl2 -> SiCl4 [Prepared by the action of chlorine on hot silicon]
Si + 4HCl -> SiCl4 + 2H2

General
Synonyms: silicon chloride, tetrachlorosilane, silicon (IV) chloride
Molecular formula: SiCl4
CAS No: 10026-04-7

Physical data
Appearance: colourless or light yellow fuming liquid
Melting point: -70 C
Boiling point: 58 C
Vapour density:
Vapour pressure: 194 mm Hg at 20 C
Density (g cm-3): 1.48
Flash point:
Explosion limits:
Autoignition temperature:
Water solubility: decomposes
 
Stability
Moisture sensitive - reacts violently with water. Incompatible with water, acids, bases, alcohols, alkali metals, organics, powdered metals.

Toxicology
Corrosive - may cause burns. Harmful if swallowed or inhaled. Stench. Respiratory, skin and eye irritant.

Can placebos cause side effects?  If so, are the side effects real?