01-21-02 02:16
No 258799
To those in the know,
After having done a great deal of research here and elsewhere, it occurs to me that very nearly every chemical required for an MDMA synth can be obtained or synthesized from OTC products. I am curious though as to some *PLAUSIBLE* (i.e. well-researched) reasons for buying specific chemicals from chem suppliers should one be inclined to get high-grade chemicals. Should someone with a reasonable background in chemistry (the supplier) be inclined to ask, "WHAT ARE YA GONNA USE IT FOR?", it would be nice to have a very well thought out, plausible reason for the purchase which would allevitate any upturned eyebrows.
Such a response would likely include:
1) The end product that the chemicals being purchased would be used to generate.
2) Detailed knowledge of the reactions which were to be undertaken. This would include specifics as to amounts of chemicals needed, contain knowledge of other chemicals involved in the production process (as well as the production process overall), and would be sufficiently vanilla (i.e. non-extravagant) as to prompt the chems to be handed over without further scrutiny.
Also, it seems reasonable that the reaction (a component of #2 above) would be a "reasonable" reaction for a home experimenter or someone trying to start a small business to undertake.
The specific chemicals I have in mind for purchase from a chem supply company are:
DCM / Methylene Chloride:
Nitromethane 99%
Both are listed as "solvents". Zubrick says Methylene Chloride can be used to clean cruddy lab glass, but what about other uses? Remember, the intent is to buy from a chem supply.
How about HgCl2? For what legitimate use would someone buy this, and in what amounts? What other chemicals should one buy at the same time to prevent suspicions?
I realize these questions could take a whole lot of time to answer and that many of the busy knowledgeable bees here might not be inclined to spent that much time. I'm not afraid of research, so even a partial answer such as "go look up how to make <blah>" would be a very helpful push in the right direction.
Thanks!
greeter
(Hive Addict)
01-21-02 02:34
No 258805
it might be better to tell them your using the chemicals as solvents instead of for reactions. Tell then you wan methylene chloride for welding plexiglass together for a fishtank or similar. As far as mercuric chloride, you can make 20g for about $50, and you'll have a hard time using up that much. I wouldn't risk ordering something as notorious as that. For nitromethane, order it from a RC hobby shop. tell them you have a custom RC plane and you want to mix your own fuel ratios. You can get methanol from the same place to make it sound more realistic(as if they care).
If Pacman had influenced us, we'd run around dark rooms eating pills and listen to repetitive music
(Stranger)
01-21-02 04:02
No 258827
Thanks for the reply :) All of this information is on TFSE though. Supposing though that I was to say I was using Methylene Chloride or Nitromethane as a solvent, what exactly would I tell them I'm extracting/washing with it?
(Distinctive Doe)
01-21-02 20:39
No 259065
Methylene Chloride aka DCM
They won't ask, its is a very common solvent. Nothing suspicious about it.
Nitromethane
Tell them its for your RC car or planes fuel. You could tell them the DCM is for your model building(solvent for paints/glues) to go along with the nitro.
NoJailForPot (http://www.nojailforpot.com/)
(Stranger)
01-21-02 23:09
No 259133
Why don't you just buy some toluene or xylene for xstalization. It's easily aquired at the paint section of hardware store,or paint store. Way cheaper than DCM as well.BTW, to answer any fools question as to what you're using it for. Just say....."I'm just the gopher.... the boss is the guy who knows what's going on, ask him." How's that!?No more questions!
(Stranger)
01-21-02 23:19
No 259137
drag racing and the constant fiberglass bodywork associated with it are nice hobbies.
(Mr. Spock)
01-22-02 10:51
No 259325
> Answering: What are ya gonna use it for?
There's only one answer to such a question: USING IT UP AND BUYING MORE!
When forced to divulge more details tell them you can't tell due to patent reasons, or do a websearch for some really obscure reactions involving the solvents to be used and tell them it will be for prototyping/analysing a new photoresist laquer for electronics production, UV curing polymers used in tooth fillings or some other bullshit.
If you want you can give them a response also consider saying something like 'We usually order the chems from out of town, but that takes a few days until they arrive and we need the chemical in question NOW. And since the hazmat fees and prices are so high we'd rather order some of the more general solvent stuff from you in the future instead of ordering from ***'. That's how you bait a supplier, not by blushing all over the place and giving them a bullshit story about your girlfriend's cousin's science project.
Live long and Prosper.
(Chef d'Equippe)
01-22-02 14:11
No 259357
As far as mercuric chloride, you can make 20g for about $50....For $50 you could make a hell lot more than 20g's, shit 20g's costs $10 from a supplier. For $50, one could make damn near a lb. of it. Baal purchased 15-lbs of a high quality reclaimed mercury for $200 last year.
Do yourself a gigantic favor, & stay away from those chem suppliers. Baal has been doing this 100% completely OTC for almost 4 years now, never signed for nothing ever. Making your own pre-cursors is kinda like chem-foreplay, all adding up to a greater sense of accomplishment after seeing that final giant coconut slurpee that you created
like some kind of designer-drug Dr. Frankenstein
GODISNOWHERE
(Stranger)
01-22-02 14:32
No 259361
Making your own pre-cursors is kinda like chem-foreplay, all adding up to a greater sense of accomplishment after seeing that final giant coconut slurpee that you created
like some kind of designer-drug Dr. Frankenstein
Lovely sentiment Baalchemist, truly lovely...
Inspirational too.
(Junior Service Representative)
01-22-02 19:16
No 259452
Hell yea, baal, I'll write that one down in my quote book.
PB
"A taste of honey is worse than none at all"
~ Sublime
(Hive Addict)
01-22-02 20:16
No 259467
Baal hit it on the money...
sWIM has everything that he will ever need, and never once had to use a chem supply.......
but a good photographic chemical supply is a necessity.....
"The gods are too fond of a joke." (Aristotle)
(Stranger)
01-23-02 04:09
No 259680
>sWIM has everything that he will ever need, and never once >had to use a chem supply.......
So what do you kids do about nitromethane? Unless you've already got a large store of it, I understand that it is now (post Sept. 11th) very hard to buy in 95+% grade due to its potential as an explosive (?) Do you distill it from RC fuel (the MSDS says *DO NOT DISTILL*)? Really this seems like the only chem that is even sort of tough to obtain, that or raw mercury metal (except in small amounts, which actually is enough).
This is a wild stab in the dark I'm sure, but please PM me if you've got an interesting method/source for either of these.
Thanks!
greeter
(Hive Addict)
01-23-02 05:59
No 259737
you can get 3 grams of mercury out of a $7 heater thermostat. as far as nitro, just by the RC stuff and distill it. it usually comes over at about 7.8% nitro, but weigh the liquid you get to make sure of the percentage. the extra methanol will be fine for cooling the reaction, and makes it easier to adjust the dripping rate.
If Pacman had influenced us, we'd run around dark rooms eating pills and listen to repetitive music
(Hive Addict)
01-23-02 06:26
No 259749
Yup, distil it, just look up my name and nitro, tons of questions, and results.......
HCl, buy it........
look around........
not at chem supply......
or make your own.....
"The gods are too fond of a joke." (Aristotle)
(Junior Service Representative)
01-23-02 06:36
No 259753
Thanks for the thermostat suggestion
!PB
BTW, 99.5% nitro was found at local performance auto shop, for $40/gallon. Is used in racing cars, or RC airplanes, etc.
concoct: To prepare by mixing ingredients, as in cooking. To devise, using skill and intelligence.
(Hive Addict)
01-23-02 06:38
No 259756
I looked into the auto pro shops when I first started, round here they had no way of getting it........
They suggested going to the airport...
yea, right.....
"The gods are too fond of a joke." (Aristotle)
(Junior Service Representative)
01-23-02 06:43
No 259758
Well, SWIP simply located the manufacturer on the net, then found a local distributor. Had one gallon in stock...
Will let you know the brand name in a few weeks, if you're interested...
PB
concoct: To prepare by mixing ingredients, as in cooking. To devise, using skill and intelligence.
(Hive Addict)
01-23-02 07:20
No 259771
I think the availability is a local thing, PB. I had no problem finding it or 55 gal drums of methanol either, in racing season. Being in the vicinity of racetracks helps. 1 gallon lasts quite a long time by the way
crucify the ego before it's far too late
and you will come to find that we are all one mind
(Newbee)
01-23-02 18:23
No 259903
Goodtimes-As I understand things, those who need nitro for racing, but don't have a local automotive source, go to the local airport.
Son of a bitch would ya look at that!
(Newbee)
01-24-02 01:12
No 260066
Not all racers use nitromethane , where i come from everyone uses nitrous oxide, its good for laughs , but no good for synthing the md-series
(Junior Service Representative)
01-24-02 01:34
No 260072
We're talking a liquid fuel here, not a gaseous-propellant. It is used in a variety of fuel mixtures for a variety of RC toys, as well as an additive to a variety of gas powered vehicles.
PB
concoct: To prepare by mixing ingredients, as in cooking. To devise, using skill and intelligence.
(Hive Bee)
01-30-02 00:22
No 262451
Supposing though that I was to say I was using Methylene Chloride or Nitromethane as a solvent, what exactly would I tell them I'm extracting/washing with it?
As far as DCM: Youre buying for the Quality Control guys, and the use they put down on the purchace form says "Thin Layer Chromatography (TLC) solvent systems." The only reason youre going to this new supplier is they have a better price than your regular one. Or you can use the whole locale and hazmat fees thing.
But dont take my word for it. Im far from an expert. Its just an idea.
-HoneySuckle