05-30-04 11:36
No 510281
Swif went back to the gakked rootbeer colored aqueous sol and discovered that there was now crystal clear liquid while the lower 1/4 was a sludge - bottom was black/green, upper layer more of a dk. burnt sienna. So seperated the two and proceeded to do pulls on both batches.
On the clear layer, Swif used Tetra (maybe should have used xylene?). Added a little extra NaOH, got the ph to around 13 (still can't discern differences in the f-ing color chart at this end of the scale), added tetra and swirled for several minutes then let sit for 20min.
After decanting Swif gassed this. Initially didn't look like anything was in there - stayed clear when gassed, but kept gassing for about 30 sec. then gave up.
Then proceeded to do the same to the dark shit, but first, in an effort to get out some of the crap and to test a novel idea, ran the sol thru a ghetto activated carbon filter (plastic bottle/funnel, charmin plug, then AC pellets). This removed most crap but left a light orangish color (should have powdered the AC and used dif filter body). This was put in the sep funnel with 75ml naptha, repeated as above, did two pulls on this batch and then gassed.
Gassing produced about 1 1/2g's from 4 gassings. Of course looked just like the previous gakked meth, including a very light blue tint in there, so he's just gonna save this until he gets some KOH to do the Unc Fester KOH/ISO wash.
THEN Swif looks at the jar with the tetra and sees a cloud of crystals floating in there - he excitedly filters this off (gassed again, nada) and ended up with little less the 1/2g of pearly white crystals. Swif rinsed these with cold dry tone, then disolved in ISO, heated then let xtals form.
Upon evapping and scraping Swif had something that STILL had a faint color, tho looked slightly yellow not blue. Burned fairly clean, left a black residue on glass, no ash or crust like the other. Tasted nice BUT DIDN'T GET SWIF VERY HIGH, even after smoking about .10g! Hours later experiencing some jaw tightness, feels tired and achy in arms, hands and leg muscles. Well this sounds like that Azi shit he's read about, <sigh>. Guess he'll follow Uncles advice and will post with results.
(Hive Bee)
05-30-04 11:50
No 510285
hmmm well if you put gakked pseudo into your reaction then most likely your gonna end up with shit product, and possibly none. Why would you do a KOH boil on your post reaction product, the KOH boil is used to clean your pseudo before it even goes into the reaction.
(Newbee)
05-30-04 11:59
No 510287
OOOPPSS! Well ok, back to the drawing board - wishful thinking mixed with this fuzzy-brained yukky high (more of a low actually). Thanks for the tip, otherwise might have had a rather strange xp to report. Will get some rest and get his head screwed on right.
(Of Counsel)
05-30-04 17:55
No 510321
You do not mention washing your solvents before gassing them, or for that matter drying them. Washing them with a NaOH solution, then hot water, then cool water should be considered necessary. Then dry them before gassing. Your product will be cleaner and you will likely have improved yields.
mostly harmless
(Newbee)
05-30-04 21:56
No 510363
Thanks for that reminder Geez - yeah Swif wasn't really planning on doing what he did, in fact he went to the kitchen originally to start deredding his 30's. When he saw that the solution had separated he got sidetracked and decided to do a couple of "quick" pulls. Quick led to failure to think the process through so noobitis has bit him in the ass once again, lol.
But on his first pull (few days back now) he did do the washes and he'll be sure to remember in the future.
(Newbee)
05-31-04 22:32
No 510588
As nasty as this gakked-meth has been (especially the day-after affects, which include fuzzy-headedness, depression, muscle soreness, overall yukky feeling), Swif's wondering if this is possibly caused by aziridine due to an incomplete rxn? If so, would re-cooking be an option? What he's read sounds promising, but also wonders/doubts it will get rid of any gakk since it made it thru the first time. Any thoughts on this? Swif thinks doing a LWR would be an interesting first for him and good practice if nothing else
. Also, if he were to go the LWR route, would the ratio's be different since he's starting with meth instead of pseudo? TIA!
(Hive Addict)
06-01-04 04:45
No 510630
Also, if he were to go the LWR route, would the ratio's be different since he's starting with meth instead of pseudo?
So your starting with meth to make meth? If you meant to say your starting with unreduced pseudo and intermediates then yes the ratios will be the same as for pseudo. If your starting with meth then you need more than a ratio adjustment.
It wasn't Me!
(Newbee)
06-01-04 05:26
No 510639
Well wasn't it you who used to re-cook your meth when you thought it wasn't clean enuf? I read your post, No 400334 Re-Cooking Meth for Higher Potentcy, where you said:
"Swis assumed that he was not getting his pseudo clean enough the first time around leaving alot of unconverted in the finished product however Worlock recently mentioned that the isomer might change from l to d in the second cook. SwiS is not a chemist and doesn't know much but SwiS does know that when he ends up with some product that doesnt really do much, he simply re-cooks it. It doesn't take as long the second time around and the workup is quick and easier than the first."
So Swif, thinking that he may have fucked up on his last batch and left some unfinished pseudo, thought he'd at least give it a try. As is the shit is not worth touching (and tried several different solvents to de-gakk to no avail) so thought the experiment worth trying at least. Appreciate any input though Shorty
(Hive Addict)
06-01-04 05:36
No 510644
Yes, as i said there seemed to be alot of unreduced pseudo so i rereacted it. So rather than throwing yours out, you might as well do the same. The ratios will bee the same as if you were starting with pseudo but the workup should bee much easier the second time around. Technically if you have some meth in there then you wouldn't need quite as much HI to reduce the remaining pseudo and intermediates, however, you have no way of knowing how much meth is there so keeping the ratios the same should ensure that you have enough HI to finish the job. The extra HI will not cause any problems.
It wasn't Me!
(Hive Addict)
06-01-04 05:55
No 510652
If your starting with meth then you need more than a ratio adjustment.FearLessBee: Don't be scared by the thought of chucking something that isn't UP to Par and chalking it UP to a learning experience
SWIF didn't get rid of the offending Gaaks on the first two passes and It's unlikely they'll just vanish into thin air by rerunning it.
Not meaning to sound like Crash Gordon but from all appearances based on description, it looks like the results of the last rxn attempt are close to receiving the
I suggest that you not waste any more chems on troubleshooting and use them on otaining cleaner feedstock.
If it's substandard GOing in....Guess what?
I'm not poking fun here.
Just driving home something that's worth driving....
And Alive...
If the shadow of a doubt exists to the cleanliness, it's not clean enough and I especially don't recommend consuming any substance until you are sure it's safe for consumption.
With todays OTC pill formulations, it's common to spend more time and energy on the front side cleaning.
I say this just so you don't feel like the Lone Stranger!
a little less conversation, a little more reaction
(Newbee)
06-01-04 10:30
No 510679
Warey,
Who said you can't beat a dead horse - this one's taking its beating just fine, thank you, and not so much as a whiney, heh heh (but Swif's arm is getting tired and he'll probably just give it a few more kicks for good measure).
And being the eternal optimist that Swif is, he's betting that the product wasn't finished. This theory is based on his analysis which itself was derived by mixing one part wishful thinking and two parts pig-headedness, a bad combination but which Swif often falls back on when confronted by difficult circumstances.
Well for shits and grins here's the situation. Swif decided to try something akin to a LWR, but decided to reduce the rp and I2 just a bit since he wasn't starting with str8t pseudo (Shorty, Swif started this before he read your last post but thinks it won't need as much HI, but we'll see).
1g yukky meth (maybe mixed unreduced pseudo and aziritine???)
1g I2
.6g mbrp
.8ml DH2o (started w/.6ml but seemed too dry due to nano-size)
Using small spice jar as vessel, Swif mixed the meth/pseudo w/I2 then DH2o then rp, rubber stopper w/punch balloon . Rxn started as placed in oil bath, nice cloud going for first hour as bath raised to 100c. Left at this temp for 3hrs, then raised to 110-115c (temp fluxes a bit due to hotplate). Last checked after 8hrs and little bubbles still forming, balloon never inflated much but Swif didn't expect it to due to size.
Swif'll check tomorrow and let her run for at least 30hrs., tho he's not sure of using the regular 36hr. timeline due to the fact that this started with (possible?) meth/pseudo combo. We shall see what we shall see
(Hive Addict)
06-02-04 01:52
No 510784
Make sure you let us know how it turns out. The first time around could have been considered as a cleaning step which happened to also start the reduction process but was kept from being fully reduced due to an unacceptable amount of gaak.
This gaak could have been left behind in the workup leaving you with gaakless meth, pseudo and intermediates which would bee difficult to identify without proper equipment. If this is the case then you will be rewarded after the second rxn finishes.
On the other hand you may have wasted your time and chems recooking gaaks. Im betting that you will be happier with the results of the second time around than you were with the first. If there was pseudo in there to start with then theres gotta bee some meth in there after all this. I would think anyway. Good luck.
It wasn't Me!
(Newbee)
06-02-04 06:27
No 510845
Thanks for that Shorty, Swif's got his fingers crossed and is busy rubbin his lucky rabbits foot too (why it's considered lucky he doesn't know since the rabbit himself wasn't ;?D).
Meanwhile after about 30hrs it looks like something's still happening, BUT this is only based on hearsay since he's not sure exactly what to look for. Right now there are still tiny bubbles working their way up through the chili but in Swif's ignorance he doesn't know if this means
A) The HI is still interacting with the pseudo or
B) This is just the rp and I2 interacting to make HI
Swif's tried to UTFSE, but still doesn't have a definitive answer so hopes more xp'd Bees will pardon his failure to grasp what may seem obvious.
Also Swif would like to know if any damage or loss of yield would result from letting the chili cook after conversion is finished? Swim doesn't think so but appreciates any confirmation or correction in his comprehension.
One problem is that 36hrs is going to be about 4am and Swif doesn't want to run all the way to the kitchen at that hour if letting it run 2-3 more hrs won't hurt things. Appreciate any input
(Of Counsel)
06-02-04 16:03
No 510947
The HI reaction will not reduce methamphetamine to something else. Once its meth, it remains meth. You won't hurt anything by letting it reflux a little longer.
mostly harmless
(Hive Addict)
06-02-04 17:07
No 510955
But should bee considered a minimum for as good as it gets results. As geez pointed out once it is meth it will cannot be changed to anything else, at least not in this type of rxn. This is why rereacting will sometimes improve a previous incomplete rxn cause even though some of it may bee meth it doesn't matter cause that meth will remain meth while the unreduced and intermediates will be reduced to meth until hopefully all that is remaining is meth.
It wasn't Me!
(Newbee)
06-02-04 17:20
No 510959
Thanks Geez, yah sometimes just need a little reassurance to chill the nooby jitters, lol. Just returned from the kitchen and saw that the little bubbles had stopped, the rp was settled, chili was clear/yellowish and it looked finished so Swif stuck a fork in it and called it done.
Swif realizes that working on such a small nano-scale presents some difficulties with success/failure hanging in a much narrower balance, but thinks it's good xp either way. Smaller glassware is just one problem as he thinks it's probably better to process his goods in containers with smaller surface areas (like where can he find a nice 4" pyrex pie plate ;?D).
EDIT: Hey Shorty, just saw your post after Swif did
Ya he's learning in leaps and stumbles, lol, but it's all good fun. Will post the results probably this evening as work becons and thanks for the good advice!