pma ---> something better?

Soap · Tue Jun 28, 2005 9:18 am

sorry if this question is increadibly stupid but swim has to ask. hes been looking aroudn for an awnser but hasnt found one. Are tehre any good methods for turning pma, or any of its purcursers, into something that is not as dangerous? swim was looking over at erowid and noticed how similar pma is to our beloved chemicals. he knows there has to be some way.
The reason i ask is, pma percursers are increadibly easy to get and increadibly cheap. swim would love to make a few kilos of pma and convert it even if the yeild was 5%....
thanks for the ideas.

Star-light · Blacklight bulb

https://www.synthetikal.com/hiveboard/chemistrydiscourse/000285579.html#Post285579

https://www.synthetikal.com/hiveboard/methods/000384303.html

https://www.synthetikal.com/hiveboard/methods/000323367.html

Soap · Fri Jul 01, 2005 11:08 am

well not to many of those look to interesting, damn if only pma wasnt so dangerous! how does everyone feel on mixing small amounts of pma with mdma? swims heard that when done corretley it isnt as dangerous and can actually induce a stronger "roll." of course swim has never tried this himself but it soudns sorta interesting. any ideas?

loki · guinea pig

methedrine is better for giving a stronger effect to mdma imho. pma is horrid shit why would anyone want to take it i am mindboggled

The_Dude · Fri Jul 01, 2005 4:04 pm

how does everyone feel on mixing small amounts of pma with mdma?

DO NOT DO THAT, YOU WILL MOST LIKELY KILL YOURSELF!!!!!!

It is PMA that is largely responsible for "ecstasy" deaths.

PARTICIPANTS AND SETTING: 22 patients who presented to the Emergency Department of the Royal Adelaide Hospital (RAH), a major metropolitan teaching hospital, between 1 January 1996 and 31 December 1998 with PMA poisoning identified through urine drug screens; and 61 patients with self-reported ecstasy poisoning between 1 September 1997 and 31 December 1998 found through the hospital databases. RESULTS: Patients with PMA poisoning presented with tachycardia (64%), hyperthermia (temperature > 37.5 degrees C; 36%), coma (41%), seizures (32%), arrhythmias (23%), and QRS intervals > or = 100 ms (50%) with greater frequency and often greater severity than those with self-reported ecstasy poisoning. Two patients with PMA poisoning presented with severe hypoglycaemia (blood glucose level, < 1.5 mmol/L) accompanied by hyperkalaemia (K+ concentration, > 7.5 mmol/L). CONCLUSIONS: At our hospital, PMA poisonings accounted for most of the severe reactions among people who believed they had taken ecstasy. Hypoglycaemia and hyperkalaemia may be specific to PMA poisoning. PMA toxicity should be suspected with severe or atypical reactions to "ecstasy", and confirmed by chromatographic urine drug screens

Paramethoxyamphetamine (PMA) is a methoxylated phenethylamine derivative that has been used illicitly in Australia since 1994. PMA is also becoming popular at rave parties in the United States. PMA raised concern when a series of fatalities resulted after its use in South Australia, where it was marketed as "ecstasy," which is the colloquial name for MDMA. In the present study, we evaluated the comparative neurotoxicity of substituted amphetamines in rats. Extracellular levels of dopamine (DA), 3,4-dihydroxyphenylacetic acid (DOPAC), homovanillic acid (HVA), serotonin (5-HT), and 5-hydroxyindoleacetic acid (5-HIAA) were assayed in the caudate of freely moving rats using microdialysis and HPLC-EC. Dialysates were assayed every 20 minutes for 4 hours after an intraperitoneal (i.p.) injection of PMA (2.5, 5, 10, 20 mg/kg), MDMA (10 and 20 mg/kg), or ---- (2.5 mg/kg). ---- produced a significant increase in extracellular DA (700%), and significant decreases in extracellular DOPAC and HVA (30% and 50%), with no detectable changes in either 5-HT or 5-HIAA. MDMA produced significant increases in DA (700% at 10 mg/kg and 950% at 20 mg/kg) and decreases in DOPAC (15% for both 10 and 20 mg/kg), and HVA (50% at 10 mg/kg and 35% at 20 mg/kg). MDMA also increased 5-HT (350% at 10, and 575% at 20 mg/kg), and decreased 5-HIAA to 60% for both dose levels. PMA produced no detectable increases in DA at dose levels of 2.5, 5, or 10 mg/kg, but significantly increased DA (975%) at a dose of 20 mg/kg. However, PMA significantly decreased DOPAC at all dose levels (75% at 2.5; 40% at 5; 30% at 10; 10% at 20 mg/kg), with comparable decreases in HVA at all dose levels. PMA also produced significant increases in 5-HT at 10 and 20 mg/kg (350% for both dose levels), with no detectable changes in 5-HT at 2.5 or 5 mg/kg. All dose levels of PMA significantly decreased 5-HIAA (50 to 70%). These data suggest that PMA, like MDMA and ----, is capable of producing dopaminergic and serotonergic neurotoxicity.

http://mdma.net/pma/pma.html

swims heard that when done corretley it isnt as dangerous and can actually induce a stronger "roll."

Have you bothered to find out anything on the pharmacology of PMA and any of its possible contraindications with other compounds?

of course swim has never tried this himself but it soudns sorta interesting. any ideas?

Don't even fucking think of doing it, very dangerous.

loki · guinea pig

like i said, desoxyephedrine and mdma is a much better combination. when people are looking to improve their mdma experience the key thing they are looking for is more dopamine. I believe that one could also create assymetric isomers of mdma to achieve the same effect - that is, put more D than L (or vice versa) into the mix. racemic mdma has two isomers which have two different effects. one of them is primarily active on dopamine the other primarily active on serotonin. the 'magic' comes from the former, and like occurs with virtually every dopamine agonist, one always needs to up the dose, which varies from DA agonist to DA agonist the degree of this. desoxyephedrine is one of those drugs with a very slow tolerance or almost insignificant buildup if doses are spaced more than about 48 hours. cocaine has a shorter inter-dose space, maybe a day or something. mdma (the dopamine active isomer) has a spacing more like a week, lsd is another drug with a long inter-dose spacing, 1 week to two weeks.

loki · guinea pig

taking selegiline with mdma is another option, it reduces the tolerance buildup rate of other methamphetamines (this i have personally experienced with the nonmethylenedioxy version)

stratosphere · Fri Jul 01, 2005 5:20 pm

regarding the first link star-light gave, the 3,5 diiodo 4-methoxy-PEA one, did i get this right?
iodine in a alkaline KI solution adds to the 3,5 postion, thats it? its that easy?
i presume the fact that you don't need nitronium or anything to activate the iodine is because of the activating nature of the p-hydroxy group?
and what role is the KI playing in that reaction?

i don't see any reason why part I of that procedure wouldn't also work with pma, of course the yield is pretty terrible, ~30%, (14g to 12g might sound good but factoring in the huge molecular wieght of iodine it is not).

if thats all there is to it and i had an assload of pma sitting around, i might be tempted to give 3,5 iodo pma a try on its own, of course if you do be cautious as to my knowledge that is uncharted territory.

Radiumhero · Thu Aug 18, 2005 11:29 pm

Well im into makin some pma too , once swirh got ahold of neat 100 ml of 4 methoxybenzaldehyd and put 20 ml of those together with 25 ml nitroethan and 3ml n butylamin in an erlenmeyer he put the dark and let it stand for 4 days , the mixture had become quite orange to red , so he thought it was time to freez out the nice p m P2NP put it in the freezer @ -20 C for a week but nothin xtaliced out
scratchin walls , cold stell , nothin helped it stayed a quite thick very viscous
liquid with NO xtals , few weeks later after havin fed up swirh took an big step toward insanity .. he took the mess added ~ 1.3 g pd/C 10% filled up with Hcl 33%
and added quite alot of aluminium he anded up with the desired 2 layers ! but there
was the organic Black ! ( pd/C) below the aq . layer wtch was the upper one
thats the current state of the experiment ( could provide some pics ) now swirh thinks of steam destillin out the P2P and A/B work up the leftover rest ,
any ideas of how gettin some good stuff out of it without too much efford are well appreciated !